Can You Safely Spend $10K a Month in Retirement? Here’s How

Indexed: 2026-05-22

[00:00:00]What would you tell someone who is in that kind of stage? You got you have to retire eventually. So, like there's no [laughter] I mean you know you can put it off and and maybe if you you know maybe you you stay longer cuz if you really enjoy the work or whatever, but it you're just putting it off and that will like if it's a life change, right? And so, would you rather attack all that when you're a little younger, maybe a little more energy than not, you know? It's between that and maybe health considerations that especially in a high stress job and as they get older it's tougher on your health. So, you know, those are a couple things I would point out. You mean you're just putting it off the inevitable. What I'm doing in this new show, Retirement Reality, is having heartfelt candid conversations with people who have already retired so you can hear from them what worked well, what didn't, and everything in between.

[00:00:43]I hope you enjoy and if you're retired and you want to personally come share your story on a future episode, there's a link right below this in the description of this episode where you can apply to be a guest. Now, go enjoy the episode. My guest today is spending $20,000 a month in retirement and he feels great about it. He saved and invested from an early age, but he also shares how he may have wished he took the little bit more risk along the way to pursue a career that might be more fulfilling. It is a fun episode filled with tons of confidence and good stories from a big traveler. Hope you enjoy today's episode. Bob, I appreciate you coming on to the Retirement Reality show. I asked my guests the same question every time for the first question, which is what is one word you would use to describe retirement so far?

[00:01:30]I would say uh relaxing. I'll use that one today. I like that. Relaxing. I've had awesome, I've had um ready, I've been ready for a long time. I've also just had freedom. So, relaxing, I love that. How long have you been retired now?

[00:01:46]So, it's almost a year.

[00:01:48]Um I did have a good 6 month I not from my retirement at my former company uh about 6 months ahead of time. So, even though it's really I really was fortunate that I kind of got to go out on my own terms, so to speak. So, about a year I actually retired almost and then I had another 6 months where I was winding down, so.

[00:02:06]Love it. Do you mind sharing with us just how that transition occurred and when you went from oh my gosh, I think I can retire to actually doing it?

[00:02:16]Yeah, so I would I'll admit I've always been a little obsessed retiring early.

[00:02:21]Um but not retiring, I always caveat that because it's more retiring from the corporate world. So, my my job was I was a I I was at the same company for most of my career. I started in an accounting firm, but then I transitioned to a financial services company. It was a very large company.

[00:02:38]And I would never have guessed I would have stayed so long, frankly. But things came up and, you know, opportunities came up. I really believed in the mission of the company, those kind of things. So, I ended up staying 26 years before I actually retired.

[00:02:49]>> Yeah, which I never even in my generation that's kind of rare. You know, like I never would have I never intentionally did that, but it just worked out. Um but I always wanted to retire like a little early again from the corporate world.

[00:03:00]Um as I got closer, you know, I at first I was 50 and then I was like, well, you know, I'm kind of it's really hard at the end because you work so hard to get to certain place.

[00:03:09]Um so, then I kind of said 55, but then um when I was 52 um I got an opportunity to kind of leave in a way where it was kind of like I was 55. I got some of the benefits of being 55. Long story, but I actually had to leave a little early kind of in a good way.

[00:03:24]Um so, I took advantage of that. So, I was 52 when I actually actually retired.

[00:03:28]Um I probably could have gone a year or two earlier. Um I've always been a saver, so like so that wasn't a as big a concern. It was probably more about just you know, I know once you leave that job, there's no like I could probably get another job, but there's no way I'd probably get the same kind of job, you know, if I you know, went back to the workforce. So, it's just really a it's you know, it's just a something you really take time to think about and and make that decision.

[00:03:51]Yeah, most people want to retire once and it sounds like you did that and did that well. What are some hobbies, should I say, or just things that you enjoyed doing that you weren't really able to do because you were just working so much that you're now doing now?

[00:04:07]Yeah, I don't know if there's a There honestly isn't a lot of that. Um big traveler, so um you know, I always thought I would wait till retirement to travel.

[00:04:16]But our kids, as they got older, really enjoyed like international travel.

[00:04:20]Which so we really started doing that like while they were still living with us, so to speak. So, I would say more travel, which I probably will do a little more travel, and probably more um slow travel, if you've heard that kind of concept before, like where you take your time and you know, maybe stay in one place longer and really kind of get immerse yourself in the culture, so to speak. Um so, I'll probably do more of that. Um another big one is just I've always somewhat prioritized health, but honestly, you know, my job was I mean, and a lot of times 60 hours a week, weekend calls.

[00:04:52]That kind of job, you know, so like prioritize health for sure, but I've always In retirement, I always thought I would do something else. Like so, which is why I always hesitated to call it retirement, cuz it's just retiring from this high-stress, you know, you know, 60-hour weekend times job that it's I liked a lot of it, like the people, it wasn't that. It's just It's just a lot, and as you get older, you just lose patience for that in some ways, you know? Like what am I doing here? Like do I really want to be doing this, you know, and stressed out and all those kind of things? So, I guess there's a lot I'm doing more of that I was doing a little of before, but I do I started just now, and I'll be talking more about it, just to pursue like what's really next. Like I got to have something else.

[00:05:34]I can talk about a little bit how I fill my time more, but it I've always known I I got to go to something part-time, like part-time work, something. Um I can talk more about that, but um I'm still probably figuring that out, honestly.

[00:05:46]You know, 10 months later, it's like Yeah, so um you know, it's weird when you retire I would say the biggest surprise maybe is how willing people are to use your time.

[00:05:57]So, [laughter] and my my kids are probably the worst offenders. So, you know, once you stop working, I mean in some ways work can be a big excuse cuz especially for me, I mean six, you know, working all these hours and you know, stressed out. It's like, "Less important, you know, sorry.

[00:06:10]I I don't have time for that or I can't help you." Now it's like you know, my son needs something. "Hey, you're not working. Why don't you Why don't you come out?" You know, he lives lives close by. "Come on, you know, you can come and help me with this." I'm like, "Well, it is nice to do those things, don't get me wrong. But it's amazing how those things you know, fill your time pretty quickly.

[00:06:28]Like it it just shocked me in terms of I thought I'd be sitting around a little more and be like, "What am I doing today?" And that really really hasn't happened a whole lot. So, That's interesting cuz a lot of people do worry about being bored and what my day's going to look like. So, do you mind taking us through a day of what Bob's life looks like? I do I I did find adding some structure, especially Monday through Friday is helpful. So, um you know, a lot of my friends are not retired.

[00:06:55]And one just like we have a good kind of set of neighbor We've been in the same neighborhood for like 20 plus years. So, we have a good set of like neighborhood friends, so to speak, and they're just starting to think about it. One just actually retired recently, but most of them aren't retired.

[00:07:08]So, I still try to live a little bit by the weekend and the week.

[00:07:12]Um so, during the week I do put some structure in of like, "Hey, in the morning, you know, wake up, watch the news, work out." Like some level of structure, then the afternoon's probably less structured. But there is even little things I found like I don't I don't watch TV during the day. Like it's just like nothing wrong with TV and that's not for everybody, but just I don't need the TV on all day. You know, even if I'm even if I'm doing stuff where I could have it on.

[00:07:34]Um so, there's little things like that, but I don't uh you know, put a ton of structure into my day, but a little bit is helpful.

[00:07:41]Love that. What has surprised you about retirement? Anything whether it be hey, I honestly I'm just not worried like before I used to worry and like you already said prioritizing health. Is it just there's a huge weight off my shoulders? Are you now at this point of what surprised me was just truly that my co-workers and friends they just couldn't believe that I did it this age and that was hard. Like what was surprising about retiring at the age you did?

[00:08:06]Yeah, it wasn't I mean honestly I've always talked about retiring early so when I even got to the Yeah.

[00:08:11]Yeah, like even my some of my I mean my mom she'd be like I thought you'd be retired by now. You always talked about that for years. [laughter] Why don't you retire?

[00:08:18]But I do get a lot I do get a lot of like some of my friends like what like what do you do all day? You know, kind of questions and they're kind of the same like they're they're my age so they're in the same spot. But not a lot of not a lot of surprises there.

[00:08:33]You know, I think one thing which people have seen right away like having more time though is very helpful for like there's things with my family friends like where I could help them in certain ways. Like I'm the I'm kind of the finance person you know in my family. You know, so like there's I would always help them but now I can actually be a little more proactive like hey, we talked about you doing XYZ. Are you are you doing that? You know, so I found ways like kind of some purpose I would say you know in helping it's helping like helping family members. We have a We have a I have a one member he's older he's having health challenges like I can help that person. You know, and that's great. Like I've never could do that before. It's like a very simple like rewarding like thing to do so.

[00:09:10]>> That's awesome. Okay, let's talk about 20-year-old Bob. You say you're the finance person. How did you become the finance person? Was it a parent? Was it a a class?

[00:09:20]I always I started like didn't grow up with a lot of money so not I wouldn't say poor by any means but you know, I didn't have any of the extras you know, just had the basics kind of thing. But growing up if we wanted any extra we had to work for it. So right away my first job was um paper route and the way it worked back then was you you're really a small business owner.

[00:09:40]You actually you actually buy the papers and then you sell them. So you're you got it like you're actually managing a business. Um and that like kind of weird kind of weird maybe but that's from day one just got me interested in business and finance. So I went to school for that.

[00:09:53]Um I ended up just having a career in that. So I always was you know I think when you're a CPA which I am it's like people just assume you know everything about taxes and everything. So [laughter] I don't know everything.

[00:10:05]Um but you know I always get the questions. So um I end up doing a lot of research for you know kind of family and friends and those things. Do you do your friends and family's taxes?

[00:10:14]A little bit. We used to have actually a family business for years. My wife's also a CPA which I know is sounds real nerdy but um she did a lot of the books for the business. So yeah a little bit um but I definitely try to like help them out with you know how to best you know minimize their taxes so to speak.

[00:10:31]Yeah it's a very complicated world out there. I don't know how people do it you know.

[00:10:34]>> [snorts] >> 100%. Let me ask this cuz I'm just so curious. I've got my list of questions that I of course love getting to but it's fun talking to cool people so I appreciate it. I see you've got that map behind you. What are some of your favorite places that you traveled to and I love that you actually brought up hey we didn't just wait till I retired like we traveled while we had our energy and health and kids were loving it. So any insights there is appreciated. Yeah um to that point you were exactly right.

[00:11:00]Like I always like I'm so glad like I don't feel we're going to travel a lot a ton. I have a lot of places I want to go but I don't feel as pressured cuz we we weren't we weren't in that type of places. You know so nice not to you know feel that feel that pressure. But I would say I mean I've been to Europe a lot probably at least 12 times I don't know. And uh really like you know if you go to Europe I always tell people Portugal is one of my favorite places um in Europe. But a couple of other cool places I've been is Iceland. I I'd highly recommend that to anybody cuz it's a very different kind of place.

[00:11:29]Um and my retirement trip was I mean it just kind of happened that way. We didn't really plan it, but uh it was Costa Rica.

[00:11:35]Which was and also like amazing place.

[00:11:38]Monkeys just sitting on our balcony.

[00:11:39]Just It's a very unique place as well. So, those are probably a few of the my favorites, but I have a I have a lot of pins on this this map right here that are like in Europe. Some a lot of like Central America, you know, Caribbean. I needed some over in the doing the wrong way here, but you know, some some in the Far East, so to speak.

[00:11:58]Yeah, I needed to get to that area of the area of the world. That's awesome. I do actually see a lot of comments coming through talking about slow travel, but I haven't spoken to anyone at length about it. For some people, I think they hear it and think, "Okay, slow travel. So, like if I want to stay an extra week, that's what I do." But I think there's more to it than that. So, you talk >> Yeah, like I We've done a We've kind of We've definitely learned Our one of our first trips was to um as a family Our kids were still on younger side. It was Italy.

[00:12:27]And even my today my son will say, "Yeah, that was a great great trip, but man, we just were running all all over the place."

[00:12:33]So, as the every year we went maybe back to Europe or somewhere else, we slowed down a little.

[00:12:38]And you know, to the point where like we'd be somewhere for almost 2 weeks.

[00:12:41]And then now I would say when I think of when I say slow travel, I would say it's more like spending a month someplace. And you know, with you really can do like >> [clears throat] >> you can do that fairly cheaply, too, if you're smart about it. You go off-season. You stay like you could stay outside, for example.

[00:12:58]You could stay outside Paris, you know, in a suburb.

[00:13:01]And train in all the time or do other things. See the countryside. You That is not You know, you could spend a month doing that easily.

[00:13:07]And it really isn't as expensive. You know, if you don't if you're not if you're not working, you know, it really isn't as expensive as you think uh to do that. I sorry to interrupt. I was just too curious. Are you booking Airbnb or VRBO? How are you actually Oh, yeah.

[00:13:19]Usually we Well, with four people we have I have two children.

[00:13:23]Uh with four people it's like it's it's to do those things, you know. Now with two people, it would be interesting with the as me and my wife just travel without our kids, we'll have to see what works best there. But, when you have like four people, yeah, I'm a big Airbnb Airbnb fan.

[00:13:36]Love it. Um how old are your children?

[00:13:40]Oh, they're both um well, actually my son just graduated, and my daughter's still in college. So, they're they're 20 um 21, or they'll be 22 in 20. Awesome.

[00:13:50]I see a lot of people hesitant to retire early because it's Oh, I still got kids in college, then grad school, and on top of that healthcare, and what if we live to be 100?

[00:13:59]Beyond running the financial projections to make sure that you're in a good spot, what about What would you say to someone who is hesitant to retire early because they go, "Well, I still have got children, and there's going to be college, and who knows about all the other expenses?"

[00:14:14]Any any insight there?

[00:14:16]Yeah, I mean, I think it just depends I guess it depends how much you saved and all those things, but you know, obviously I think everybody wants to help help their kids. And even today, you know, you think of like stuff you've you've heard about the news, like housing prices. You know, it's hard it's hard starting out. You know, I think it There's probably some validity to that. Uh but at the same time, you know, you can't do everything for your kids. I mean, you can give them some help, but you want them to be resilient people. You don't want them to be overly dependent on their parents, you know?

[00:14:40]So, I would say like you want to be there to help, and maybe you can strategically help in certain places. Um but at some point, I mean, they got to figure it out, you know? And and uh that's what I had to do. You know, like I mean, my parents definitely helped me, but they didn't you know, they I wasn't you know, getting money from them after I graduated college, kind of Yeah, no monthly stipend there. No, no, not at all. My parents were the same way.

[00:15:03]Um okay, let me ask I'm just I'm fascinated. When it comes to having that financial brain, what I see a lot of is people who are really intelligent, they are always running the scenarios, the Monte Carlos. They're going, "Oh my gosh, analysis paralysis" sometimes.

[00:15:19]You've got not just one smart financial brain, it sounds like, but maybe two. I- Is your wife equally involved in the planning process? Does she go, "Hey Bob, I'm going to let you run that. I trust you." How do you guys manage finances?

[00:15:33]Uh well, one thing we do talk about a lot is how we want to spend our money.

[00:15:36]So, and that's, you know, to me that's what it it all starts with that. Like, how much, you know, what like it's not so much the amount, it's like how and like what really, you know, do you still have you can see yourself doing in retirement and making sure you can afford those things. So, we definitely talk about that a lot. When it comes to projections and things, I've definitely done some of that. Like, obviously used to be, you know, years ago, you have a bad day at work, what do you do? You run your projections.

[00:15:58]>> [laughter] >> It's just like it's somewhat therapeutic, you know? You know what it's going to say. You know what it's going to say. It's like it's telling you new.

[00:16:04]Um but uh I've kind of passed that. Like, I I think once you get a certain point, like I mean, I I didn't grow up with a lot of money. I like I don't I'm not too worried about like running out of money or anything like that. I mean, the worst scenario, if we had to do something to alter our spending, which I don't foresee it. It is what it is, but like honestly, once I, you know, I I probably worked a little harder than I should have, you know, in some ways. You know, so I really have the problem of like, can I go at the right time, you know, financially is more like, okay, when's the right time to give up work and, you know, let let it go.

[00:16:36]Was it difficult to go to your boss or co-workers at the time and say, "Hey, I'm I'm doing it."?

[00:16:44]Yeah, it was a little weird cuz I was a little on the younger side.

[00:16:47]Um but one thing that really influenced me at the company I worked at was I It's not that simple, but there were people like me who were like, "Hey, I want to retire when I can and just move on to other things." And there was others that um I mean, literally, they they put so much of their identity in their job that they struggled to like they didn't want to leave. I mean, there was people that like you some some jobs you had to retire at 65, they they worked to the last day, you know? So, I was always just floored. Like, and I would tell people at the company that. I'm like, "These people want to stay till 65. I'm not doing that." You know, like all along I was always pretty honest about like, "I'm not going to be here till 65.

[00:17:24]I'm just telling you right now." You know, so it [laughter] wasn't It wasn't a big shock.

[00:17:28]>> told them and they're like, "Why was it Why'd you wait so long?"

[00:17:31]>> Yeah, so it wasn't a big shocker in some ways, but again I I worked with great people and treated me extremely well, so I was probably lucky cuz it's corporate world's tough to navigate, you know. I I know a lot of friends. I got lucky, I think. I mean I have a lot of friends who got laid off in you know you know later in their career and it's hard to recover from that and so I I was pretty fortunate. Yeah, that is difficult, but it sounds like you were not struggling to actually go do it, which I hear a lot of. I hear a lot of like, "I don't want to tell them I'm retiring early at 53 or 54 or whatever age because I know they're nowhere close to it. I don't want to make them feel bad, but then again I do want to put myself first." So, it's actually it's it's nice to hear you went, "Yeah, no, I'm doing what I want to do."

[00:18:12]And one thing I always tell people too when they ask me like, "Wow, you retired early." I always say like, "Well, if you like your job and you're happy and again, I liked my job, but it was just a lot. It was really a lot. And I was I kind of was getting burned out.

[00:18:23]But if you like your job and you you know maybe it's something you can do and still it doesn't prevent you from doing other things you want to do, so to speak, keep doing it. Like that There's nothing wrong with that. You know, there's no It's not a contest. I mean, if I was in a job I loved and it was 40 hours a week, I'd probably still be working, you know. I So >> That's that's a great outlook. I talk about the recreational employment phase.

[00:18:42]I actually hate the word retirement.

[00:18:44]Retirement to me sometimes feels like, oh is it ending or like am I just done?

[00:18:48]No, recreational employment, are you working because you want to or because you have to? And if you like doing it, like to your point, keep doing it. You did already maybe do some foreshadowing on this, maybe unintentionally about maybe part-time something. Are you thinking about some other aspect of work or was I picking up on that incorrectly?

[00:19:05]>> Yeah, I have found now like cuz I'm now it's like 10 months in whatever. Like there's definitely things it's great I have time to do and help family members and things, all kind of, you know, stuff like that. But it's probably not quite enough, you know, to kind of keep me occupied. And I think there's something to um just having, you know, being committed to something. Like I did a this training course and something I just wanted to learn more on and I had a It was a couple hours a day, but it's just nice to have something like I signed up for, I committed to it, I have to I have to do it, you know, like just not have a your whole world just being, you know, open, you know, having a little almost put some structure in your in your day a little bit, too. So I've always Well, there's certain like small business things I wanted to do and and uh you know, I've always kind of risk-averse about quitting my job and, you know, risking my family finances for that. So now I'm at a point where that's not an issue. So I There's definitely some like part-time things I want to explore and and that it's something with like the company I worked at was, you know, like we really helped our customers, but I was so far removed.

[00:20:01]Like I I never talked to a customer, you know?

[00:20:04]>> [laughter] >> Like I was in finance I was in corporate finance. I didn't talk to, you know, customers. So doing something I'm trying to do something I can do where I can help people and also, you know, like directly, so to speak, if that that makes sense.

[00:20:16]Are there communities and groups that you said, "Hey, I'm going to join these, volunteering" or you're like, "My time gets spent with my son's needs"?

[00:20:24]>> [snorts] >> No, I I I just like there I think eventually I I I want to try some like, you know, like again, part-time work or small business, you know, kind of like consulting.

[00:20:34]Something like that first. I mean, after you know, I think eventually I would get into more more um volunteering. Um like I thought about that. I know there's some things I could do like um I think AARP has a program where you can volunteer like tax.

[00:20:47]You know, I probably do something like that cuz you know, things There's probably some volunteering. I was also um kind of lately tested the waters at teaching.

[00:20:56]Yeah. Cuz I do have a like a a degree I can I can teach certain subjects.

[00:21:01]Um so I'm I'm also exploring that. I like that. You're let's just call it in between. You're retired from that job. I like that. I'm retired from 60-hour weeks, bosses, deadlines, commuting. If you had Did you have to do commuting or was it work from home?

[00:21:16]Oh, no, it was both. I mean, COVID not so much, but otherwise it's, you know, half hour drive, which, you know, by California standards is nothing, but by Ohio standards that's, you know, that's rush hour. Yeah, that's that's a road trip. Um, okay, let me ask this. When it comes to the financial side of things, and feel free to, of course, share as much as you'd like or as little.

[00:21:36]I will find some people go, "Yeah, I want to spend 5,000 a month. Oh, now I have way more time. I'm going out to eat more. I'm doing stuff. I really need 8,000. If I had 15, then I'd be really comfortable." Do you find your spending a similar amount each month? Does it wildly fluctuate outside of travel?

[00:21:53]Uh, now one thing I did do in the past couple of years was as I was approaching potential retirement, is track spending.

[00:22:00]And I wouldn't, you know, I wouldn't do it like it to the finite degree, but I would track like how much we spend on travel. Yeah, for example, you know, some things like that.

[00:22:08]Um, so I do have a good sense of what we spend money on. It's not It's not so much trying to cut expenses. I just like really like the idea of like I'm going to spend money on things that I value.

[00:22:17]And, you know, so I do track our spending more so from the standpoint of like are we spending a lot of money on you know, junk? I don't know. Like, you know, like things we don't need. And so, I do track it. Um, it fluctuates with travel quite a bit.

[00:22:30]Um, and, you know, we still are supporting our kids in certain ways.

[00:22:35]Um, so it does, but um, you know, I don't I don't I'm not a budget Nazi or anything of that of that nature.

[00:22:40]>> Yeah, yeah.

[00:22:41]Okay.

[00:22:42]I just like knowing where money where I'm spending money. I don't mind spending it. I just want to know where it like where it's going. Makes perfect sense. Is there an amount that you find generally, excluding travel, if you take big trips or go first class or anything like that, but that you're like, "Hey, it's generally in that, you know, it's 5,000 >> You know, we we plan spending with travel, which is lumpy, but uh averaging out to about 20,000 a month. Awesome. Yeah, we have Yeah. We have clients that go 20,000 a month. I don't even know how I could retire. And we have other clients that go, I don't even know how I would spend that amount. Do you um find that when you are spending on those, let's call it more high-ticket items, it's like, "Hey, I've saved and invested for this. I'm doing it guilt-free." Or is it still weird because you're like, "Gosh, I know I can do it, but it just feels weird."

[00:23:29]No, I mean, I don't It's almost like I really don't have a problem um spending on things. I don't know. I mean, even though I'm a frugal person, my wife is, too, but over the years we realized, like, what are you What are we saving all this money for? You know, you can enjoy it. And you know, we're we're at a point in our lives where this is, you know, where we Our kids are still, you know, they're they're in college, but we still see them a lot. Like, do trips with them.

[00:23:50]Like, why wouldn't we spend money on this? Actually, my my uh my grandparents um or my my wife's parents, they they instead of like giving us gifts over the years, they've always taken us on trips.

[00:24:00]Best gift ever. Like, like, you know, that was that We've I've kind of seen that, how well that goes. And so, I I don't have a problem spending money on things. Um It's kind of It's If you had talked to me like 10, 15 years ago, it might have been a little different. Yeah, but that's awesome, though. I love that. What about saving for retirement? There's a lot of people that will just max out their 401k, do everything they can, sacrifice like lifestyle entirely. Doesn't sound like that was an issue of yours because you're able to spend on trips and things along the way. But, what was that experience like earlier on your career versus in your 30s and 40s? Did you ramp up spending as you made more money along the way? Was it, "I'm always going to try to get the employer match."? How did you approach that?

[00:24:42]Yeah, I think the biggest thing we did, which um we were My wife and I got married fairly not right after college, but fairly fairly so. But, we got married and, you know, living together, we were right away said, "We're going to live on one income."

[00:24:56]And it's amazing And you know this is doing what you do, but like it's amazing the money we save in our 20s and early 30s like what that's worth like like saving early is just I I didn't even know what I was we knew what we were doing, but we were just like wow we're going to she actually stayed home with the kids. Um most of the time.

[00:25:15]She works some part time, but the first 10 years we just we we saved one income and that alone is just you know that that's probably why I'm retired early. I mean we saved a lot of money along the way and I was fortunate that you know did well in my company, but that was a big I I tell my kids that all the time you know a dollar you save in your 20s is worth like 10. You know, I mean just it's it's phenomenal. [snorts] So Do they listen? Do you feel they're like or they're like oh dad I get it you love this stuff?

[00:25:48]No, they listen. I think they they they they they they've you know they've appreciated their lifestyle I think and they understand like you know that takes saving it doesn't come you know it doesn't happen automatically.

[00:26:01]Yeah, that's awesome. Did you see a change in yourself when you retired?

[00:26:06]Uh probably just a generally a generally nicer person. I don't know.

[00:26:10]>> [laughter] >> I mean when you're like again I was in a pretty high stress job and it wasn't like just me it wasn't like my job it was like everybody around me. Like we were all in the same I mean it wasn't like you know it was just the the last couple years um just the division I was in just going through some tough times that makes it always tougher on everybody. Um it's doing fine, but like the the point is like you know I'm just so stressed all the time. It's just like you know it's um you know I just have less patience for other things. Now it's like you know nothing I don't get rattled very often that's for sure. So That's awesome. There's a a phrase I hear a lot I can't wait to retire and re-date my spouse cuz it's been 30 years we haven't really seen each other.

[00:26:50]I obviously your your wife isn't with us today, but in terms of her retirement and how she's viewing her time and you guys having more time together, are you like, "Oh, this is awesome. Like, we're almost like in our 20s again." How do you look at that? She actually she she actually went back she's uh she's actually still working.

[00:27:06]Okay. She had an opportunity they asked her to kind of come back to her company full-time.

[00:27:10]And she kind of missed out on work.

[00:27:11]Like, this is not in the financial plan at all like, you know, but she um you know, this is her last chance to kind of work so to speak cuz her it's company she knows people. So, she's actually went so you know, we've kind of a little bit we've had a little bit of a role reversal where like, I'm trying to make her life easier. It's not It's not like a It's not easy job or anything like that. But, it's it's a you know, at least a 40-hour week job kind of thing, but um I'm trying to you know, make take everything else off her plate, you know, in terms of so she can actually I won't say enjoy work, but have that opportunity cuz she kind of she gave that up, you know, frankly having kids.

[00:27:44]She would have had a great career if she didn't if she didn't stay home. That's awesome.

[00:27:48]>> kind of she kind of gave that up. So, it's like you know, this is her probably last chance to you know, work a little bit and actually, you know, just have that experience. I don't hear that often. I love your perspective because most people are like, "Here's what you got to do. Look, I retired early. I did it. My job was good. It gave me a good lifestyle and here I am." You're like, "No, if if I would have loved it, I would be keep doing it and my wife enjoying it." Could you see your wife continuing to do do it for a good amount of time or not?

[00:28:11]>> Oh, I don't I mean, as long as she likes it kind of thing, but we definitely want to do things, you know, with you know, travel and things like that. So, her job's pretty flexible, but at the end of the day like I yeah, I don't see her like doing a super long time or anything like that. Neither of either one of us ever, you know, wanted to work like in our 60s and and that. I just if you know, if if we could make it work, obviously you know, some easier said than done. You know, I I definitely acknowledge that.

[00:28:37]Um but you can. It's just like as you get older I just don't you know, working full-time you know, I'm not that's that's Love it.

[00:28:43]>> something I wanted to do.

[00:28:44]Yes, makes perfect sense. There's a lot of people who have hesitancy to retire early because of health care. That's one of the biggest reasons people are, you know, reluctant to do it at the age that a lot of people like yourself are able to do it. And I'll often talk about, okay, pretend you truly had to pay out of pocket for everything. Could you still afford it? And I'm not saying you'd like doing it, but can you do it?

[00:29:04]Did the health care aspect give you pause that you think made you delay a few more years? Or why do you think you said, "Hey, I know I could have done it earlier." you didn't?

[00:29:13]Yeah, that never really fazed me too much. I know it could be a big It could be a big outlay. I That's the one reason I think I mentioned this briefly. I was going to work till 55 because that's something like I there's a benefit I get from my employer working to that age. And I ended up getting I ended up getting it anyway the way I I left the company. So I actually have access to health insurance till I'm 65. If I want [clears throat] it. I don't know if I'm using it. I'm not using it now. Yeah. Now it's not It's not that cheap, honestly.

[00:29:40]Um but it's like something that's there.

[00:29:41]So that kind of gave me Again, it's not that cheap, but at least I I can always get it. I'm I'm guaranteed to get it, you know, kind of thing. So that gave me a little bit of peace of mind. Um even though it's not cheap that I have something and cuz the health insurance environment seems very volatile, you know, changes.

[00:29:58]Um I got a ways to go for for Medicare.

[00:30:00]So Yeah. Um so that getting that benefit out of my Yeah. Can I guess how much just for fun? Can I guess how much you're you could pay just for fun?

[00:30:08]No, I'll tell Oh, you can guess, yeah. I was going to say $850 a month. Oh.

[00:30:14]Yeah, it cost It's like about $2,000 a month.

[00:30:16]What? $850? So $2,000 for each of you?

[00:30:20]Uh no, total. Total. Got it. Okay. Got it. So So maybe I Okay, maybe not far off what you were. Yeah. But no, but still the fact that two I mean, that to your point is it's a significant amount of money you're looking at. Let's call it $25,000 a year or so. And but what I love about what you're sharing there is if you're if you have the means to do it, there's people that go, "Well, that just seems crazy. So much for health care." but if you have the means to do it, why not do it?

[00:30:45]No, I've never bought into that. Like, it means it's an expense. It's can be a big expense, honestly, but I never bought into like, that should drive your retirement. I mean, like you got to put the budget or your spending, but at the end of the day, it's like you spend a lot more on travel than that, to be honest, you know.

[00:31:00]>> Yeah, no, makes perfect sense. I love I love you have a very healthy outlook of this. I want to ask just in terms of imagine you can speak to someone who's hesitant to retire early. Financially, they feel good to go. Would you be like, look, just make sure you have some things planned, but to be honest, you your son's going to call you all the time. Obviously, everyone's situation is different, but if you could speak to someone and say, "Hey, if your finances are set, cuz there's a lot of people who do have comfortable finances, but they're unsure is the right time." We'll talk about often times at Root, "When's the last time you've done something for the first time?" And people like myself, I just got married. So, that's new, hopefully new and for the final time.

[00:31:42]And I don't remember before that I mean, the last thing I did for the first time went to college like 9 years ago before that. So, there's a lot of people who are just scared to make this change, and it sounds like you've done an amazing job.

[00:31:54]I can hear it and feel it from you.

[00:31:57]What would you tell someone who is in that kind of stage? Well, I don't think I'm perfect. I'm sure there's things I've not done well. Um but I would say like maybe like the story I told about you know, some people in my company, if you know, you got you have to retire eventually.

[00:32:10]So, like there's no I mean, you know, you can put it off and and maybe if you you know, maybe you you stay longer cuz if you really enjoy the work or whatever, but it you're just putting it off inevitable, you know? And would you rather tackle like it's a life change, right? And so, would you rather tackle that when you're a little younger, maybe a little more energy than than not, you know? So, um it's between that and maybe health considerations that you know, people tend to you know, if they're especially in a high stress job and as they get older it's tougher on your health. So, you know, there's a couple things I would point out. You mean, you're just putting off the inevitable.

[00:32:44]So. Or you're going to die at your job, which that's that's fair, too, I guess.

[00:32:48]>> [laughter] >> Yeah, if you really love it, but that's your that's your You could die in your parking spot. Um your confidence is coming through the screen, which whether you recognize or not, it is really truly, Bob. I talked to a lot of people who retire early and they're like, "Yeah, I hope I did the right decision.

[00:33:02]Did Did I do the right decision?" Like they're almost asking for validation.

[00:33:05]You're like, "Dude, I don't even I don't even get it. Like just if you have the means to do it, go do it, enjoy it." But you're also being honest saying, "Look, when you took that course, it felt good because you had something you kind of had to do." Do you struggle with that in terms of, "Okay, I don't have deadlines anymore or projects and it was kind of fulfilling to have that" or you're like, "No, I'm glad I did it that time and then I was really glad I was done with it."

[00:33:29]Oh, no, I I would still want to pursue more of those things. Like, you know, some level of it's just finding something again. I'm not going to give up my Like I think about teaching, for example. Mhm.

[00:33:39]It's done you know, I've done a little bit of that like in past lives. And you know, I I I hesitate because, man, it's like a very But there's no flexibility in that.

[00:33:46]Like, I've got friends who've done that, you know, and like the class goes on.

[00:33:50]Like this is this semester, you know, you can't like take a vacation in the middle of the semester, you know, so but I really would enjoy doing it. So, it's just finding things that like I that could be, you know, hit check certain boxes that as I kind of mentioned before, you know, can be flexible but also like truly helping people.

[00:34:06]Um so, I'm still searching for that thing. Hopefully, if I talk to you in a year from now, I I have that. But I would say at the same time like I don't feel rushed to find it, you know, I mean like I I know it's out there and I I'm thinking as time goes by, it probably would be more of a gap in my retirement not having like something part-time or doing something like that.

[00:34:23]But I don't feel like I got to run out and find it tomorrow, if that makes sense.

[00:34:27]Yeah, it does make sense because I'm thinking right now out myself. I go, I can tell that you would enjoy it if you could work part-time, but to your point, look, if you're working at a university as an example, they've got, you know, the the system that they're on, quarter system or semester. And if you're like, that's the time to go to Portugal, you can't really say like, "Hey guys, so here's the thing." So, um that makes perfect sense. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:34:50]I'm curious, just as the the point I would like to end on, if it's okay with you, unless there's anything else you care to share, but what I like to do at this point is I like to go silent for about a minute. I like to let you talk to your younger self. And there might be someone out there who's in their 20s listening to this or 30s or 40s who knows what age, and they want to just hear, okay, what should I have done? And they get to hear it now, and you get to give yourself credit. You could be like, "Hey, remember that one time you were thinking about leaving, but you didn't and you stuck in it and good job. Like, look at you now. Like, you retired early and you did it. You told people you would and like, great job." You can also share, "Hey, the the biggest thing was living off the one income." Whatever it is that you think someone else would take tremendous value from hearing, I will stay silent for the next minute and let you share.

[00:35:36]Yeah, I'd probably say just early on finding the right balance of saving, but also doing a career you like. I'll admit it, like, if I could look at back at my career, um I liked it most of it, but, you know, I was always worried about making money.

[00:35:51]Um so, and that, you know, it helped me in the long run, but, you know, looking back, like, should I have tried to do something, you know, left that company and said, "I'll do something do do more of a variety of things." So, I would just encourage like somebody in their 20s like find a balance. I mean, in this world you have to save money.

[00:36:06]You're you know, you're on your own for it. I mean, you know, the way this the way this world is set up, you have to especially in America, you need to take control of your retirement savings.

[00:36:16]So, find a way to save money, but don't don't do that at sacrifice of like still enjoying your life in the time, you know, wherever you may be. Um I just you know, there's some people that I think go too far with that and just all I do is say worry about saving money. I wouldn't go that far. You got to find that happy medium.

[00:36:33]And a lot of times if you find what you'd like to do, it all kind of works out.

[00:36:37]Great advice. Bob, so appreciate you coming on and that's it for this episode. Thanks, Bob. Nice nice talking with you. You, too.

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